Heather Bellamy spoke with Vivienne Pattison from Mediawatch-UK about the effect of pornography on a younger generation and a significant event in Parliament

Vivienne Pattison

Those under 30 make up almost one fifth of the UK population, yet despite their childhood and teenage years being only recently behind them their voices are often unheard in debates about pornography and our culture. That is why earlier this year Mediawatch partnered with other groups to organise an event in Parliament entitled 'Pornification of a Generation - the Under 30s Perspective'. To find out what happened Heather Bellamy spoke with Vivienne Pattison from Mediawatch-UK.

Heather: How big an issue is pornography amongst young people?

Vivienne: We suspect that it is a very big issue. When we talk to people there are very few teens that we have come across who haven't been exposed to it. In fact research suggests that the average age in which a child is exposed to pornography in this country is 11 and some studies have put it at even younger. We don't know the scale of the problem, because the research isn't there and isn't being done; it's very difficult to do ethically, but we suspect it is absolutely huge.

If we are looking at some of the things that are coming through now, for example children finding themselves in court for sexual crimes, it very often points back to pornography. So what we wanted to do was give the under-30s, who've been through this, who are the digital generation, a chance to say what it was like for them, so that people in power can hear what it's really like.

Heather: Can we talk about some of the consequences or effects of viewing pornography? You have obviously just touched on one, but there's this whole thing of sexting, isn't there? Has that come about because of pornography?

Vivienne: I think what pornography has done is normalise sexual content online. Sexting obviously isn't anything to do with the content that's available online - it's to do with conduct, the way we behave - but I think it's very difficult to separate them out. I always thought: "Why would anybody want to indulge in sexting?" I can't think of anything worse than sending a photograph of me to anybody without anything on: I would rather die. You might want to make some comments there about body-issue images, which pornography has been implicated in, but anyway I've found that very difficult to understand. The NSPCC's research shows us that 60% of young people have received such an image and 40% of people have made one. So this isn't unusual niche behaviour: it really is quite mainstream. I think it is quite hard for people over 30, of my generation, who are horrified by it - but it's now quite mainstream and we need to understand why that's happening and what we can do to mitigate any potentially harmful effects.

Heather: Have there been any studies done as to why this is happening and developing?

Vivienne: Not at the moment. We are still in the early days of this. There are lots of little bits of individualised local research, but what we don't have is something that we can point at with a big finger and say, "Here's the evidence, this is the proof." It just doesn't exist, partly because the funding isn't there, but partly because it's incredibly difficult in terms of ethics. If you think pornography is harmful, it is hard ethically to show one group of people some pornography, which you think might harm them, and the other group not. So it's just not happening. There are moves afoot and work is being done, but as things stand at the moment, we can't say, "Here is the damage. Stop it! Block it!" So it's really important to hear the testimony of people who've been through this, because often, what we hear are people who I would say are in the pro-pornography lobby, who tell us it's great, it's wonderful and it's sexually liberating. We need to hear what it's like for the normal kids who are growing up through this; what it was like to be exposed to this stuff.

Heather: And what sort of things did you hear?

Vivienne: It was very interesting. I think we can split the speakers into two. We had those who had something professional to say about it, to do with their careers. We had someone who worked in education, a psychotherapist and a youth worker. But we also had some incredibly brave people - two men and one woman, because this isn't just a problem for men - who talked about their own battles and their own addiction to it. In fact they were talking about being exposed as very young teenagers and how it had drawn them in and how it had affected their relationships, their view of themselves, their sexuality and in one case even their ability to perform sexually. It was quite harrowing stuff to listen to, but really important that we hear this kind of thing. When we stop talking about issues of policy, it's important for people to hear what it might be like for somebody out there and to hear the first-person testimony of what it's like from somebody who's grown up in this world.

Heather: So do you feel the event was a success in relation to its aims?

Vivienne: It absolutely was. We had an awful lot of MPs joining us during the day. Very often when you do these events, if you get one or two, that's considered pretty good. We had somewhere between 25 and 30 popping in so it was really good. Those who went to the event said they'd learnt a lot and it had really opened their eyes.

This event was put together by a number of groups working in this area, but actually that's it: our work is done if you like. However we now have a group of under-30s who've spoken to each other, who realise what's happening to their generation and they're committed to taking this further and they're now branching off on their own. I understand they're in the process of organising another event to take place later in the year, in a pub in London I think it's going to be, to talk about the issues and to get some more young people, some more of their peers, talking about it. They have got performance artists too and I think a singer as well, to talk about the effect that it has had on them and to call for some change and for the Government and the powers that be to take notice of this and start thinking about it when they put together policy.

Heather: You mentioned that those young people were very brave sharing their own personal stories. Do you think the whole subject is becoming less of a taboo subject?

Vivienne: In some ways I think it is. I think there's a certain level of bravado in society about pornography and how extreme it is, but I think it is always going to be difficult for anybody to bare their soul and actually talk about the truth and how it has affected them. It is very difficult to say, "I used pornography" and although there's less of a stigma, there is still a stigma I think. It's even worse for people to say, "I've used it and it's affected me and it's affected very personal aspects of my life," and to talk honestly about that. In fact I think in some ways to talk honestly about the way that anything has affected you is difficult, so I salute them. I think it was extraordinarily brave and they could see the harm that was coming to the generation below them: they didn't want them to have the same problems they have had!

Heather: And finally, you said MPs were coming into that event. What would you be hoping MPs would do now they've gone away having heard that information?

Vivienne: What we wanted to do was present them with the information, because it is quite difficult to get. I think lots of MPs don't really meet people in their late teens and early 20s. For better, for worse, politics in this country has tended to move on beyond that and there is a disengagement across society. The MPs we spoke to said, "We don't get many young people coming to see us at our surgery, wanting to get involved, apart from those who are thinking they want a career in the political life." So it was very valuable for them to hear that and hear what young people are doing.

I am over 30, I didn't grow up with the internet. I went all the way through university without an e-mail address. That's almost impossible to conceive of now and I think if MPs are the same age as me they'll be thinking the same: they won't completely understand what it is to live in a connected society. It's harder to avoid pornography than to come across it. We want them to really think about this when they're putting together policies and education policies. We want them to have that in their mind and think, "What should we be doing to protect the generation? We had one that grew up unprotected: what can we do for the children growing up now?"