Rebecca Duffett spoke with the Boaz Trust

Rebecca: What is the long-term future for these people who find themselves in the UK? It seems from what you're saying they are in a bit of a no man's land situation.

Dave: Yes absolutely. They're called living ghosts. It is a total no man's land because they can't go back because they seriously believe that they will be persecuted, jailed or perhaps killed. It's for their faith; in some cases it is because of their ethnicity or political persuasion. They can't go back; yet when they're here they have nothing. It is a total no man's land. Some people have been in that situation for over 10 years.

Rebecca: Where are a lot of asylum seekers coming from; you mentioned ethnicity and religion? Is there a trend in the sort of people who are asylum seekers?

Dave: If you look at the trouble spots around the world and particularly trouble spots that have got a link to us, that's where they'll be coming from. There's a lot of Zimbabweans at the moment, and we know what is happening in Zimbabwe, it's a really difficult situation there. There's not just poverty, but if you're a member of the MDC you've probably seen somebody in your family killed at some stage by Mugabe's supporters; so it's fear of that sort of persecution. People are also coming from places like Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq. You could argue that we've caused some of the problems there and now we're picking up the pieces because the people are coming here. In places like Eritrea, if you are a minority religion, particularly Pentecostals, also Jehovah's Witnesses, then you will be persecuted. You can't meet openly. If you do meet openly then you'll be put in jail, it's that simple. Leaders are rounded up and put in containers in the desert. It's a horrendous situation for them.

Rebecca: And so they see the UK as an easier place to live?

Dave: If you talk to people, what actually happens is they just escape from where they are to the nearest place they deem to be safe. Although people say, you've come through many countries to get here; a safe place for most people is the western world. If you escape from a country in Africa to get to the next country, that's no safer than where you've come from, so you get out to the West. The same would be true for Afghanistan and Iraq and places like that. They don't all end up in England though. There are many more that end up in other countries; we're not the main recipient of asylum seekers.

Dave with two clients

Rebecca: Am I right that a lot of women and children seek asylum as opposed to whole families?

Dave: Most of the people who are here are singles. It's far easier to get out if you are single than it is to bring a whole family at once. Often it's the men that come and later on, if they are given refugee status they will try and bring their families over at a later stage. Sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't. It's probably about 60% of men and the rest women.

Rebecca: Can you really support these asylum seekers long term, or is it just a case of giving them somewhere to stay or giving them some food on a short-term basis?

Dave: When we started out it was simply a reaction to an enormous problem. Back in 2004 when we started, it was a case of who's got a spare room? Can you put somebody up otherwise they'll be on the streets? We developed the policies after that. What we are able to do is to provide accommodation while we're looking after people. It's what we call catch, hold and release. We catch them because they are in such a desperate situation. We then look and see what we can do with them while we're keeping them. Hopefully we can get their cases looked at again by a solicitor; or we can find something that we can help them to move on with, even if that's finding a friend that they've got, that they can go and stay with.

Rebecca: How do they find you or you find them?

Dave: Sometimes it's word of mouth. We did have a referral process so everybody has to be sent to the one-stop refugee shop. There's a Refugee Action in Manchester and they will refer to us but we get referrals from all over the place. We get referrals from hospitals that've got somebody in there who's going to be discharged and they have nowhere to discharge them to. We get referrals from the Medical Foundation and loads of different places, but many of them come from Refugee Action and self-referrals.

Rebecca: Are you overtly Christian in what you do? Do you give them Bibles and teach them in that way as well?

Dave: We offer that and take opportunities when we get them. We've just had three people going through our church Alpha Course. We've had a number of people who have been converted or whose faith has been renewed through contact with us. One young Muslim had a vision of Jesus coming into his room. He was somebody we'd helped practically. I think it opens people's hearts up. Often people of other religions realise who's helping them; it's not the Mosque; it's not the Temple; it's the church that's helping. Then they begin to question, why is that? Then they're much more open to hear the gospel.

Rebecca: How is the organisation run? Do you have volunteers?

Dave: Yes, we've got eight staff, four full-time and four part-time. It's grown to quite a big organisation. On top of that we've got about 45 to 50 people who will put people up in their houses and we've got people that loan us houses. We've got folks that run people around to Doctors and Dentists appointments. We've got somebody who runs the advocacy team, which is helping them with their cases, finding solicitors, getting their paperwork in order, all of that sort of stuff.

Rebecca: If someone has been refused asylum, then is it legal to put them in their homes?

Dave: They're guests. The only thing that could be deemed illegal as far as I can see is if that person was on the run. When they're refused they usually get a letter and it requires them to go and report to the local reporting centre. If they're complying with that, then they are doing what they should be doing. If we're putting people up in our homes, then it's just having a guest staying, the same as anybody else. They're not doing anything illegal and the truth is, even if it was illegal, would it be wrong to do it? There are lots of things that Jesus did, which were illegal and lots of things that his followers did that were illegal, like not worshipping Caesar and stuff like that. There are all sorts of things that are right that may not be legal.

Rebecca: Have you ever had an asylum seeker in your own home?

Dave: Yes, quite a few. I had two ladies who were due to give birth within a week; one Chinese and one Nigerian. One had been released from jail; she was on her way to Canada with a false passport. She got six months in jail for that. She was stopped and put in jail and when she was nine months pregnant we got a phone call at the office which said, we've got this lady and she's being discharged today and we don't know where to discharge her to. She slept on our sofa bed until she went into the hospital.

Rebecca: Do you not think that putting up asylum seekers could be quite a scary thing to do?

Dave: A lot of people have got that question. We have a scheme, we have a hosting co-ordinator who will go and visit potential hosts to talk with them and when they are ready to start then we will seek somebody that will fit with what they want. If somebody says, I've got young children so I don't really want a man in the house, or I've got a teenage daughter so I only want a female, then we will do that. If people say they can only do it for a couple of weeks until my son comes home from university then we will do that. Whatever they are able to offer that's what we do. I think in the hosting scheme we've probably placed 200 people in the last five years and the only theft that has been reported to us has been £3 in pennies.

Rebecca: If people have been encouraged by what they've heard and want to help you out, what is the best way to help, is it through financial donation or perhaps coming forward to host?

Dave: I guess it depends where people are. If people want to get in touch with us to find out how to host or set up a scheme to host, that's great. I go around the country and try and help people to set up schemes, whether it's a housing scheme or a hosting scheme or a night shelter scheme. We've got 23 partner organisations across the country doing various things in different localities. We need money as well because £280,000 is the budget for this year and if we had more we could do an awful lot more.

Rebecca: If people were to donate money what would it be spent on?

Dave: Well, we've got a £7,000 shortfall on the night shelter this year. We need to find £7,000 before the end of April and we're looking for a permanent shelter. At the moment we're accommodating 12 men who would otherwise be on the streets getting frost bite in this weather. We'd like to increase that number and have a permanent place. Any money would certainly be going there. On the advocacy work, we'd love to be able to employ a solicitor, because legal aid has been cut and many people who go to appeal don't have a solicitor. The situation is really bad, so it's no wonder so many people are getting refused.

Rebecca: Have you got contact details if people want to find out more?

Dave: Yes. Our website will be renewed fairly shortly, but it's still pretty good. It's www.boaztrust.org.uk. You'll find lots of information on there; information if people want to volunteer; how they can get involved; how they can give.